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satoru: I think that's not entirely true imho

Thronebreaker was banking on just the IP of the Witcher but not the 'core' witcher audience who are playing the RPG game aspect. Like the same way you can have Skyrim and have people literally buy that 5 different times on different console and different editions, but they'd probalby never drop a penny on Elder Scroll Legends the CCG

With Cyberpunk however you do have the cache of it being "SciFi Witcher" which would easily draw the core audience of the Witcher in regardless of the platform.

If GOG continues to bleed money, I don't see how they don't do this. GOG Direct to me just screams "GOG exclusive" as well.
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BleepBl00p: The 'core' witcher audience doesn't even know what 'RPG' stands for...
But said 'core witcher audience' (aka the 'dumb masses') certainly has a general (and of course absolutely warped) idea of what a 'RPG' is supposed to look and play like these days. And an archaic isometric cRPG/CCG hybrid it is not. Even with the tagged-on "Witcher" brand.
And people (at CD Projekt RED) wonder why it doesn't sell that well, (timed) exclusivity or not.
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kohlrak: No, it screams of "doing what everyone else is doing." Everyone has somethign they call "direct," now. What even is gog direct? Usually, companies use "[Comany name here] Direct" to pretend they have some sort of connection to the community. From what i've seen, it almost looks like an avenue for DRM.
I feel like you don't know what GOG DIrect is. It's basically just an automatic game registration system between a reseller and your GOG account. Rather than the reseller giving you a GOG key which you input into GOG. You simply link your GOG account to the reseller, and then when you buy a GOG game it will automatically get registered to your GOG account.

The only company that has anything remotely close to GOG Direct is Uplay. Which is how uplay games activate automatically from Steam and Humble once you link your accounts.

Steam used to have a similar feature in Humble via their OAuth mechanism. But they removed that after awhile. These days they use it more via things like thier Curators program, but that's more of a 'key management' mechanism so that devs can verifiably send games to actual streamers instead of the plethora of scammers that resell them on places like G2A

If you already think this is a mechanism for 'drm' why would it not surprise you that its also a mechanism to make Cyberpunk a DRM exclusive game?
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ReynardFox: I'd start by firing the curators.

But... plenty of people have offered actual, constructive criticism for the longest time, I don't think at this point anything we say or do is going to have one lick of impact on a deaf website.
They more or less need to get rid of why they use curation in the first place. Curation is just the tip of the iceberg with regards to how much GOG imho 'gets in the way ' of devs.

They're far to invested in being not only 'curated' but being some kind of 'middle man' for every game on their platform. This is literally unsustainable as the more games you get the more this 'middle man' service becomes pure bloat to maintain for the entire platform.
Post edited March 01, 2019 by satoru
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Nalkoden: ...
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BleepBl00p: Isn't it a myth that the actual developers get money from bought games on GOG? I mean they are merely employees and I doubt they recieve a share of each sale. They get paid an hourly rate while they work on the game, then they get a paycheck and that's it.

If anything we are supporting greedy IP holders by buying on GOG.
Good point. Well at least it can still be applied to indie developers that don't have a publisher. And even if they have a publisher, maybe some of them get percentage of sales? I don't know enough about it. I should really look into it. :/
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kohlrak: He didn't say to get rid of curation, but instead to get rid of the ones that make bad calls and, presumably, hire someone else.
Though my comment was more bitey than tactful, this was what I meant yeah.
Post edited March 01, 2019 by ReynardFox
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satoru: I feel like you don't know what GOG DIrect is
Yep, you got me.
It's basically just an automatic game registration system between a reseller and your GOG account. Rather than the reseller giving you a GOG key which you input into GOG. You simply link your GOG account to the reseller, and then when you buy a GOG game it will automatically get registered to your GOG account.

The only company that has anything remotely close to GOG Direct is Uplay. Which is how uplay games activate automatically from Steam and Humble once you link your accounts.

Steam used to have a similar feature in Humble via their OAuth mechanism. But they removed that after awhile. These days they use it more via things like thier Curators program, but that's more of a 'key management' mechanism so that devs can verifiably send games to actual streamers instead of the plethora of scammers that resell them on places like G2A

If you already think this is a mechanism for 'drm' why would it not surprise you that its also a mechanism to make Cyberpunk a DRM exclusive game?
Yeah, this mechanism sounds like a way to sell steam games on gog, then. Essentially, there'd be no enforcement method on GOG's part to ensure the games are DRM-free, if everything is offloaded externally.

As for cyberpunk, i'm not really sure what i expect from GOG, anymore. We've had these bitchfights with them before over galaxy, and they did back off, but with what's been going on lately, the writing seems to be on the wall again: get your games out on gogrepo.py and prepare for the worst.
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ReynardFox: I'd start by firing the curators.

But... plenty of people have offered actual, constructive criticism for the longest time, I don't think at this point anything we say or do is going to have one lick of impact on a deaf website.
They more or less need to get rid of why they use curation in the first place. Curation is just the tip of the iceberg with regards to how much GOG imho 'gets in the way ' of devs.

They're far to invested in being not only 'curated' but being some kind of 'middle man' for every game on their platform. This is literally unsustainable as the more games you get the more this 'middle man' service becomes pure bloat to maintain for the entire platform.
Yeah, but then they'd end up itch.io with forums. I've bought games off itch, too, but let's be honest, GOG would really plummet, then, as they'd have nothing left to say that they have that itch doesn't. IMO, gog needs to be far more liberal with the system, however.
Young gamers love 4K~8K HD 3D AAA games, or F2P casual games with microtransactions.

Retro gamers that have money and want to spend on old games, already bought everything that they want here.
I think GOG could try to sell Amiga and retro console games, which they already try to grab.

I also want to buy C64 and Apple ][ games on GOG, but I doubt they will sell much.
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kbnrylaec: Retro gamers that have money and want to spend on old games, already bought everything that they want here.
Diablo
Warcraft
C&C
GTA
Legacy of Kain 1

??? Not even close. The best of the best of Retro games, have yet to appear here. But seeing that they became too niche, old games i mean, i seriously doubt we will ever see them...

Also, other oldies that aren't in copyrighs hell/libo, ones that are pioneers and benchmarks in their genres, such as:

Cybermage
Sub-Culture
The Reap

Still haven't even been considererd by GOG, to be negotiated for, yet! Maybe, they are too niche, too!

And finally, certain indies that would make great additions, such as Plants VS Zombies 1...

I myself, have bought in here, far less than HALF of the old games, that i am genuinely interested in! But i cannot do anything about that... Only GOG can. But doesn't wanna. Hell, they don't even referrence wishlist entries and number of votes, anymore!
Post edited March 02, 2019 by KiNgBrAdLeY7
If you put money in your gog wallet, does gog get its share only after you buy something with that wallet money?
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How to help GOG? Stop giving them money so that they realize the impact of their stupid decisions.
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BleepBl00p: Isn't it a myth that the actual developers get money from bought games on GOG? I mean they are merely employees and I doubt they recieve a share of each sale. They get paid an hourly rate while they work on the game, then they get a paycheck and that's it.
That's completely wrong in the case of most indie games.
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BleepBl00p: How to help GOG? Stop giving them money so that they realize the impact of their stupid decisions.
You have been registered here just since a few months (and ranting since then) but you still think that you even KNOW what GOG is all about? Get lost - please!

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XYCat: If you put money in your gog wallet, does gog get its share only after you buy something with that wallet money?
No, it would be the same as if you would buy a game with your money. So GOG is getting your money the moment you are buying wallet funds.
Post edited March 03, 2019 by MarkoH01
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BleepBl00p: Isn't it a myth that the actual developers get money from bought games on GOG? I mean they are merely employees and I doubt they recieve a share of each sale. They get paid an hourly rate while they work on the game, then they get a paycheck and that's it.
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MarkoH01: That's completely wrong in the case of most indie games.
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BleepBl00p: How to help GOG? Stop giving them money so that they realize the impact of their stupid decisions.
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MarkoH01: You have been registered here just since a few months (and ranting since then) but you still think that you even KNOW what GOG is all about? Get lost - please!

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XYCat: If you put money in your gog wallet, does gog get its share only after you buy something with that wallet money?
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MarkoH01: No, it would be the same as if you would buy a game with your money. So GOG is getting your money the moment you are buying wallet funds.
Tell me, is GOG a store focused on old games or indie games?

A lot of people believe that they are supporting devs by buying old games.

What does it matter if I'm newly registered? Doesn't take a genius to realize that the overall store design is garbage and painful to browse through.
Post edited March 03, 2019 by BleepBl00p
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BleepBl00p: A lot of people believe that they are supporting devs by buying old games.
According to Tim Schafer, yes. Every income generated from old catalogue helps.

We have our own back catalogue now from games that we've self-published, like Brütal Legend on the PC, and all of our games that we've published we build to generate revenue from them, and every time we have a big Steam sale or a Humble Bundle we'll generate more money we can invest back into Psychonauts 2.
https://www.pcgamer.com/tim-schafer-talks-psychonauts-2-and-more-remasters-of-lucasarts-adventure-games/
Post edited March 03, 2019 by zlaywal
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BleepBl00p: A lot of people believe that they are supporting devs by buying old games.
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zlaywal: According to Tim Schafer, yes. Every income generated from old catalogue helps.

We have our own back catalogue now from games that we've self-published, like Brütal Legend on the PC, and all of our games that we've published we build to generate revenue from them, and every time we have a big Steam sale or a Humble Bundle we'll generate more money we can invest back into Psychonauts 2.
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zlaywal: https://www.pcgamer.com/tim-schafer-talks-psychonauts-2-and-more-remasters-of-lucasarts-adventure-games/
This is an isolated case. Devs don't invest money in the games they make, there are no reason for them to get a cut.

Do you think you are supporting Mc Donalds employees when you buy a Big Mac?
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BleepBl00p: Do you think you are supporting Mc Donalds employees when you buy a Big Mac?
There's a percentage of the sale a Big Mac that will be used for supporting McDonalds employee. Minuscule? of course! That's how pricing works. Try reading about cost accounting if you have some spare time.
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BleepBl00p: The 'core' witcher audience doesn't even know what 'RPG' stands for...
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Swedrami: But said 'core witcher audience' (aka the 'dumb masses') certainly has a general (and of course absolutely warped) idea of what a 'RPG' is supposed to look and play like these days. And an archaic isometric cRPG/CCG hybrid it is not. Even with the tagged-on "Witcher" brand.
And people (at CD Projekt RED) wonder why it doesn't sell that well, (timed) exclusivity or not.
Actually, if I had to guess, I would say that the fundamental problem with Thronebreaker wasn't the game engine (I'm still playing a dozen isometric 2.5 dimension 3rd person RPGs) — it would have been the Gwent tie-in. The biggest selling point for me (and most / everyone else here?) is the DRM-free process. And Gwent is antithetical to that. So, if it was an experiment to see how DRM-lite might fare in the customer demographic, it certainly provided some definitive data.