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General discussion (archive)Make Transistor become available on GOG!(46 posts)(46 posts)
(46 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted May 21, 2014
Disappointing. I bought Bastion on Amazon and it gave me a DRM-free installer, so I really thought they were into that kind of thing.
Posted May 21, 2014
I still don't understand why Bastion isn't on Gog if its DRM free elsewhere?
Posted May 21, 2014
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tfishell: Will there be a stand-alone DRM-free version of Transistor for PC?
"We have no plans for a stand-alone installer for Transistor at this time. The Steam version of the game includes various features that require Steam, such as cloud saves, achievements, and trading cards, and for launch we did not want to create a separate version lacking these features. Note we have put no DRM in Transistor unless you count Steam as a form of DRM. Once you’ve downloaded the game from Steam, you don’t need Steam to be running in order to play."
Well now hang on.

The game includes various features which make use of Steam, right?

But they then go on to say that you don't need Steam running in order to play, which would render all of those features inactive anyway. So if they've built DRM-free functionality into the game, why the Steam requirement (to install)?
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ShadowWulfe: There it is! I vaguely remembered a reason for their raging hard-on for Steam, but I had forgotten it and filed it into my "never going to happen" folder.
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tfishell: I do wonder how hard it would be to make a stand-alone installer.
Really really easy... by their own admission. If all the Steam features are optional in the Steam version then all they need to do is put that exact version in an installer. If they were willing to release the game here they wouldn't even need to do that. Just the files over to GOG.
Post edited May 21, 2014 by SirPrimalform
Posted May 21, 2014
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darktheory: Nice game, but I think GOG needs more good OLD games these days. :(
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pimpmonkey2382: This.
Nothing against new games and GOG selling them, absolutely; yet I feel inclined to join the above posters.
Posted May 21, 2014
Make it so number one!
Posted May 21, 2014
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tfishell: Will there be a stand-alone DRM-free version of Transistor for PC?
"We have no plans for a stand-alone installer for Transistor at this time. The Steam version of the game includes various features that require Steam, such as cloud saves, achievements, and trading cards, and for launch we did not want to create a separate version lacking these features. Note we have put no DRM in Transistor unless you count Steam as a form of DRM. Once you’ve downloaded the game from Steam, you don’t need Steam to be running in order to play."
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SirPrimalform: Well now hang on.

The game includes various features which make use of Steam, right?

But they then go on to say that you don't need Steam running in order to play, which would render all of those features inactive anyway. So if they've built DRM-free functionality into the game, why the Steam requirement (to install)?
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tfishell: I do wonder how hard it would be to make a stand-alone installer.
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SirPrimalform: Really really easy... by their own admission. If all the Steam features are optional in the Steam version then all they need to do is put that exact version in an installer. If they were willing to release the game here they wouldn't even need to do that. Just the files over to GOG.
It would be similar to the GOG version of Spelunky.
Posted May 21, 2014
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Niggles: I still don't understand why Bastion isn't on Gog if its DRM free elsewhere?
Publisher: Warner Bros.
There's your reason.
Posted May 21, 2014
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tfishell: Will there be a stand-alone DRM-free version of Transistor for PC?
"We have no plans for a stand-alone installer for Transistor at this time. The Steam version of the game includes various features that require Steam, such as cloud saves, achievements, and trading cards, and for launch we did not want to create a separate version lacking these features. Note we have put no DRM in Transistor unless you count Steam as a form of DRM. Once you’ve downloaded the game from Steam, you don’t need Steam to be running in order to play."
This is something which bugs me. There's no need to create a seperate version. If the game already works without Steam running, then you're done. All that's needed is to pack the files in an installer, which GOG does for you anyway.

edit: oops - if I'd finished reading the whole thread before commenting I'd have noticed that SirPrimalForm already made this argument.
Post edited May 21, 2014 by Barefoot_Monkey
Posted May 21, 2014
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SirPrimalform: ~snip~
I think what they're saying here is that technically it would be no problem to offer a separate DRM-free version, they just don't want to do that because they feel their game would be incomplete without all the Steam features and either they don't want to encourage people to play it offline without those features or they feel it's wrong to charge for an 'incomplete' version. ("And why would anyone not want to buy the Steam version? Steam is awesome!" etc.)

Not that I'd agree with it, but that's how I read their statement.
Posted May 21, 2014
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tfishell: Steam is not DRM, similar to how GOG is not DRM, they're both digital distributors. But the fact that Steam forces a client on you could be considered DRM, obviously.
I thought CEG is the reason Steam is considered DRM. The client itself is only a distribution channel, similar to how when people download installer files through HTTP at GOG. Granted, you get an installer and not "installed" files but if the game works with the latter that's not the important issue. The issue with Steam falls back to CEG, they encrypt the .EXE-files. Without that you can play the game without the client (like with Desura).
Posted May 21, 2014
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Starmaker: Bastion was DRM-free in a humble bundle. Currently, they sell it through the humble widget and advertize it as DRM-free:

Download Bastion now, cross-platform, DRM free, and redeem it on Steam!
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Starmaker: So yeah, Supergiant knows what "DRM-free" means, they just choose to be hypocritical asshats.
Actually the widget is misleading ; i bought Bastion some time ago via the widget and it came with a stand-alone installer & a steam key.

For Transistor, they probably focus on the Steam version + PS4 version atm , and maybe it will be avaible like Bastion was, but i have a doubt since the widget offer only a Steam key :(

Their speech about cloud + steam achievments & such is just bullshit, how they did for Bastion ? :p
Posted May 21, 2014
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tfishell: Steam is not DRM, similar to how GOG is not DRM, they're both digital distributors. But the fact that Steam forces a client on you could be considered DRM, obviously.
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Nirth: I thought CEG is the reason Steam is considered DRM. The client itself is only a distribution channel, similar to how when people download installer files through HTTP at GOG. Granted, you get an installer and not "installed" files but if the game works with the latter that's not the important issue. The issue with Steam falls back to CEG, they encrypt the .EXE-files. Without that you can play the game without the client (like with Desura).
It seems to be rather vague. I think a lot of GOG's "old-timey" members here believe only CEG is DRM, whereas, perhaps, some of the newer members who only know of "Steam = DRM!" think the client in and of itself is DRM.

Part of the problem is the lack of communication: you don't hear Steam tell people many games are actually DRM-free and can be played directly from the .EXE, possibly because they don't want to upset publishers by letting people know they can put these files up for pirates (or something like that). Likewise, I don't think GOG has really ever said, "Well, technically Steam has DRM-free games," because they know that could hurt their brand.

I won't buy on Steam anymore because I'm interested in helping the competition who can give Steam a run for its money, ie GOG (although that enthusiasm comes and goes admittedly); for example, the Humongous games - I won't buy them until installer files are released from some service.
Posted May 21, 2014
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Nirth: I thought CEG is the reason Steam is considered DRM. The client itself is only a distribution channel, similar to how when people download installer files through HTTP at GOG. Granted, you get an installer and not "installed" files but if the game works with the latter that's not the important issue. The issue with Steam falls back to CEG, they encrypt the .EXE-files. Without that you can play the game without the client (like with Desura).
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tfishell: It seems to be rather vague. I think a lot of GOG's "old-timey" members here believe only CEG is DRM, whereas, perhaps, some of the newer members who only know of "Steam = DRM!" think the client in and of itself is DRM.

Part of the problem is the lack of communication: you don't hear Steam tell people many games are actually DRM-free and can be played directly from the .EXE, possibly because they don't want to upset publishers by letting people know they can put these files up for pirates (or something like that). Likewise, I don't think GOG has really ever said, "Well, technically Steam has DRM-free games," because they know that could hurt their brand.

I won't buy on Steam anymore because I'm interested in helping the competition who can give Steam a run for its money, ie GOG (although that enthusiasm comes and goes admittedly); for example, the Humongous games - I won't buy them until installer files are released from some service.
I would say that CEG is "activate to play" DRM, where the client install mechanism is "activate to install" DRM. If you need to be logged into a client to install then your licence is being authenticated at the time of install and I would call that DRM. It's DRM that can sometimes be bypassed by zipping up the files but it's DRM nonetheless.

There's a difference between being invited into a house and sneaking in.
Post edited May 21, 2014 by SirPrimalform
Posted May 21, 2014
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tfishell: Part of the problem is the lack of communication: you don't hear Steam tell people many games are actually DRM-free and can be played directly from the .EXE,
That's a misleading statement. MOST games on Steam (compared to their library size) cannot be run without the client software.
Post edited May 21, 2014 by Niggles
Posted May 21, 2014
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tfishell: Part of the problem is the lack of communication: you don't hear Steam tell people many games are actually DRM-free and can be played directly from the .EXE,
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Niggles: That's a misleading statement. MOST games on Steam (compared to their library size) cannot be run without the client software.
The DRM-free games are still many, even if they're a minority compared to the DRM'd ones.

Ah, wait "misleading", not "false" or "wrong".
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General discussion (archive)Make Transistor become available on GOG!(46 posts)(46 posts)
(46 posts)