any wolves baying at that moon?

I just finished up my course yesterday, so I'm a wee tired as well.

It's not typically apparent that men and women need separate spaces in which to hang out at times until you're the only man or woman in a class, then it becomes really obvious that you need somewhere to vent about that experience. There's definitely a multiplier effect that goes on and I definitely was leaned on hard to buy into the notion that they were the minority and not I.

Under normal circumstances women aren't allowed to serve in the front lines in our military. That's gotten a bit grey in recent years as we don't really have front lines lately, but they are still barred whether or not they're capable of keeping up.

In the US it is hate groups like http://www.pornharms.com/ which seem to be driving it at this point more than anything else.

I remember not too long ago when scientists figured out how to turn an egg into a sperm all the gleeful comments from women about how they no longer needed men. I'd be very curious as to the reaction if we were to invent an artificial uterus and turn a sperm into an egg what the reaction would be.

Most of the time when I run into "feminists" the more apt term would be "misandrists" as the ones I run into typically don't know jack shit about the situation and have absolutely no interest in finding out what it's actually like being a man.

It's astonishing to me how many women seem to think that they are entitled to marry somebody really great when they treat men like crap. Here's a hint, perhaps if you would ask me out rather than sexually harass me I might say yes. Also, hands off the merchandise. I know that it ought to be clear to anybody with half a mind, but the rules of consent apply both ways.

I'm with you on that.

Men actually do get raped in the US at a much higher rate than most people are willing to admit, they receive very little sympathy from society, in fact being public about it at all will probably mean people will start spewing all sorts of bigoted trash about you. If it happens while you are in prison some people will say you shouldn't have committed a crime to be in prison (like prison wasn't a just punishment, you had to be sexually assaulted for your crimes as well).

Even with all that, knowing people who've lost body parts, I suspect you may be right. A lot of men would rather suffer in silence having been raped than seen to lack a body part which reduces their sexual desirability and causes a bunch of other social issues (you do get the good parking spot, but I don't think that's a fair trade, really).

Speaking of particular women lying about who got them pregnant for various gains.
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=118455 I think he went too far with leading her on, he’s certainly not the saint in this whole affair but it’s pretty fucked up what she tried to pull. The real tragedy in it all is that the only reason he got out of it so quickly was because of a permanent procedure that could be backed up with documentation. The only other option is a DNA check which comes with its own various social backlashes depending on how the stories told and she could have kept on playing her game for much longer. It’s some pretty hefty hoops when a female can pretty much just claim it.

Women do have a lot of control in this particular area, inherently but also due to society’s messy decision on the issue and unfortunately some seek to take advantage of it.

Just to throw in the biblical perspective for the heck of it (this is just what I remember from it and may just be referring to Jewish laws):

Woman was supposed to fight and scream for help if she was in a populated area, if there was no chance of help she could suffer in silence (some people advise women to never fight back, for their own safety).

If this was straight from God it could be taken as a responsibility to protect yourself. I just think that is an interesting idea that letting someone walk all over you is a sin.

heh wouldn't it then, if you wish for women to get the same treatment with the selective service, be proper to allow them the front lines if they want to first?

i had just a quick look at that site, i'll look into it when my mind is clear, but the short look was enough to make me roll my eyes. those people should just find some proper interest in their lives...

i think those gleeful comments were made by women like the one who wrote that post on the blog. it's not difficult to imagine their enraged reaction at an artificial uterus. i told my mum about all these extreme things in the american society and she said such extremist women should be sent to the army :)

oh and I actually was in a school where i was the only female 2 years ago. me and 15 guys+the male teacher. i also know a guy who was the only male among 30 girls in high school (he was actually loved by all those girls). but obviously our social environment is radically different. neither of us needed to vent. however if we did, isn't it enough to just go to a bar or some park, or the male toilet, or to ask a friend to come to your place to talk?

... is as ridiculous, yes.

Powerless and weak I understand; those feelings come with being the victim of any violent crime. Dirty, however, seems to imply ruined, tainted or impure, as if being overwhelmed and raped has somehow lessened your worth as a human being, as if you have been damaged forever in some significant sense. That may be the way rape that makes a woman feel, and I empathize. But the point of what I'm trying to say is that it's not true. Feeling violated and hurt is normal, but a woman isn't dirty or spoiled or worthless because she has been raped. That's a holdover from a misogynistic culture that doesn't value women as full human beings. Once you discard that perception, saying that rape is worse than death seems as ridiculous as saying that being beaten and mugged is worse than death. I don't want any woman to have to experience rape, but at the same time, women need to understand that rape doesn't have to be life-destroying.

Also, I don't mean to attack you at all. I wouldn't have posted again, but I really do suspect that our perception of rape makes it a much more devastating experience for women than it would otherwise be.

I don't think that anyone should have to suffer in silence (justice ftw), but you're on target: What I was getting at is that we (as a society) seem to expect men to be able to rationalize and cope with rape and other violent crimes in an objective manner yet encourage women to view the same as a life-shattering super-crime. We shouldn't trivialize the crime of rape, but at the same time we need to recognize that fostering an inflated view of rape (one that I suspect stems primarily from misogynistic cultural values that we've supposedly transcended) increases its destructive psychological power. When we look at the facts of rape, we can see that although it is a painful and personal violent crime that should not be tolerated, most of the lasting harm seems to come not from the act itself but from ridiculous social perceptions of it.

I freely admit that I might be wrong here. I'm pursuing the line of thought because it seems reasonable to me and because I doubt that most people are willing to even explore the topic. So if I'm off-base here or if I ascribe too much power to our perception over our reality, bear in mind that my intent wasn't to offend.

Well I said that rape is worse than death for *me*, emphasis on me and my personal opinion. I also said that i am by no means representative because I suffer from ocd and phobias(bacteriophobia being quite bad, my opinion should be more understandable now, as well as my range of definitions of dirty). I thought it was clear but I guess I should have explicitly said that it means that every other girl who doesn't most likely doesn't feel that way at all. We don't learn/use expository writing here and tend to write implicitly.

I understand what you're trying to say. You presented it in a different way and with a different tone, so I can't really disagree this time. However while it is a factor, I think that it's more complex than that because of the complexity of human sexuality. Which is something I don't feel like discussing or analyzing, and something I feel that men can't understand or discuss properly when it comes to women, nor women when it comes to men. You have to be one to get it.

Also, while I am aware that male rape is not nearly as discussed or taken seriously, just for the record, I've never thought that it's not as bad for men as it is for women, and same goes for all of my friends.

Btw out of sheer curiosity, when you say that statistically male rape is just a tad lower than female, how much of that accounts for women and men, especially grown up. Because (and I am by no means diminishing the issue), when it comes to grown ups raping grown ups I find it harder to imagine that the number of women raping men is almost the same. But not impossible, there are seriously strong women and seriously weak men, and there are always dirty tricks to be used.

Btw I didn't feel attacked at all, no worries :)

Yes and no, honestly, some can handle the rigors and some can't. The more likely situation would be to have them test for it. The work load there is designed for men and some men can't handle that. It's been fairly common to lose a few to suicide or overwork during boot camp, those are folks who end up dead even before they have the chance to get shot at by the enemy.

There are definitely women who can handle it, but by virtue of their smaller size, it's less likely that they'd be able to carry the equipment needed. All that armor plated stuff isn't exactly light.

Men don't talk in the restroom, and there are plenty of women at bars. Women who likely have been drinking and are even more likely than usual to be willing to resort to violence to squelch opposing view points. It might have to do with the fact that we're often times issing in a trough, but the whole bathroom area is typically a speech free zone.

A lot of it has to do with the fact that there isn't much attention given to the male experience in the US, the belief of many women is that that view is everywhere, and it's not. That's a sanitized version which at this point receives a sign off in order to be on the air at all.

Yes, but my point was that you can't ask for the same treatment until you solve the issues that would be clearly discriminatory. It's like "you must do this like men but you're not allowed to do it like men". The testing is a logical solution, but I also wonder, wouldn't a big part of male soldiers look down on and even laugh at women there in spite of their ability? And if something goes wrong blame them for being the 'weak link'?
The army issues are something that men need to solve among themselves first, on many levels.

edit: the issue with the armor theoretically could be solved by producing a different type of armor or something. however i am clueless about these things. i am sincerely not interested in anything related to war, weapons or fighting. which is why i also don't like or play fps games, so i couldn't have learned it that way either

I don't mean to insult but heh I can't help but feel that you tend to be spoiled a little, being such a rich country and all. Because often you think that everything has to be readily available. I don't know, but I find it hard to believe that there is no bar (or some place to eat or whatever) with fewer women who aren't drinking alcohol, but coffee, or that there is absolutely no bar where there are few people minding their own business, or no bar where there are guys drinking most of the time. There is always a way, and you can always find it if you want, it doesn't have to be readily served and labeled everywhere. Separating places for men and women just to talk is reinforcing the differences and issues and is no solution, but a step backwards.

That definitely.

Adult men are typically raped by other men. Certainly there are cases of women raping men who are heavily intoxicated or whatever, but it's usually another man who is the perpetrator. Of course, adult women have coerced young men that couldn't have (legally) given consent. Whether that fits your definition of rape or not, it does fit the legal definition.

How would this not fit your definition of rape? I sense one of those inane prejudices which claims that every minor would (at least secretly) enjoy having sex and/or that this would somehow prove to be a great experience for him; something to envy him for. That’s biased bullshit machismo or would you say the same about cases involving the opposite sex?

The age of consent (or the definition of a minor) is a very subjective concept. It varies considerably from nation to nation, culture to culture, between time periods, etc. It's not a simple matter.

the problem of armour is that it is damn heavy. add to this equipment, guns, spare ammo and heavy clothes it creates a problem which cannot be bypassed with modern technology.
on average women are weaker than men. therefore noone expects there to be fifty fifty gender split on battlefield even if we assume 100% equal society.

Additionally I cannot imagine any professional soldier laughing at fellow soldier just because she is a girl.

look down. yes. that will happen and that happens between men too. for that not to happen one just needs to prove that he/she is better than that person. and problem mostly solved.

the army issue is something to be solved by two genders working together not by just men.